I   want to keep this thread going so I will put a post here and when time gets more  I will comment farther .. but for now.

 grampa had olivers...   2 88's he liked.. got a 1800 gas...  that was an oops..  

that was my mothers dad...
others side   had other brands.... THE only other brand  and when  grampa  bought  one of those he sold his 1800.....  that ended the olivers. until   I got a Super77 at a sale.....