Andy:

I got your message.  I do think that there is always more than one way to skin a cat.  I would agree with you that with this group you have to watch where your going.  

I like the web as a way for thoughts to get out to the members.  Even though it may be most of the same guys posting I do think a lot of other members look at it.

As much as the Tablors can be a pain where you sit I wish we could convince them to stay in.  You have to have members that are interested to keep the club alive in the future.  The old guys will be gone and no one will pick up the slack.

If the magazine keeps getting better and gets delivered a little quicker I think things will get better.

Have you heard of anyone wanting to start a new national club?  I haven't.  I really think that would be bad for both.

Bill Brandt

[quote:2w1kqvu0]Hey Bill,
I thought it might be a good thing if you knew what my objective is, and the tactic I am attempting to use. There are several older members who set up HPOCA, it is my opinion that it was set up to maintain control, when you take an in depth view at the structure, this is pretty obvious. My objective is to break this control structure. I know most of those who support the structure the way it is, they are not on the committee, but I do have a fence sitter or two, but they will go with the majority. It is very important that don't let the cat out of the bag too soon, as the old school guys know very well how to manuveur around, and manipulate. They don't want to have their holy grail adulterated. I know this, I sat at Lancaster with one if them and was told all sort of provisions that they had made in the bylaws, most of these I had already caught, and got changes made. I'll discuss that the next time we can talk. 
Anyhow, my tactic is to weaken or eliminate this hold, that is all that I hope to accomplish. To do this, first appointed directors has to go, we have got that thru committee. Next is to change nomination procedure, I got that thru, but as a compromise. I wanted direct, but accepted a compromise that eliminates an appointed nominating committee, and replaces it with one which consists of volunteer from the floor, drawn from a pool by lot. Just these two things give the members back considerable control of the organization. Another biggie is to allow the bylaws to supercede Robert's. A couple of those guys are expert parliamentarians, they put that in there for a reason. I asked one of them about it, stating my suspicion, the whiskey was talking for him pretty well, and he confirmed my suspicion.
I want to get a specific procedure on amending bylaws worked up, which will empower the membership, and get that thru committee. I have some ideas, but they would undo the current procedure considerably, as well as tie up some loose ends that were left that way on purpose. 
I mentioned opening a door, this is the door.
Once opened, the members will not allow it to be closed. I hope you understand this, and I hope you understand I should exercise caution, not to be blindsided.
If we can make these changes, and open these doors, other things can be done later. I have had an ongoing battle for the last 7 or 8 years, to give back the association to the members, all I have gotten was small concessions, and lots of lip service. So, I have found the last 2 or 3 years that the slow quiet approach works better, that raising a big ruckus. I even got the Iowa Attorney General's office on them at one time, most haven't forgotten that one. They offered benefits to the members, published them, and couldn't or wouldn't deliver.
You got a sample in your 45 minutes what I have been up against. Of course, I am not going to show my hand, you did that, see what happened, nothing! I did agree with you on most of the procedural issues you raised. I couldn't say anything, or I would jeopardize what I am trying to do. They would circle the wagons so fast it wouldn't be funny! They would somehow get to the other committee members, and convince them I was up to no good. The committee is totally independant from the board, does not report to them either. That doesn't mean it is not watched, it is. All that means is a different strategy has to be used. Let them watch, let 'em see what they want to see, then do what needs done for the members.
I hope you will keep this in confidence, I just figured you should know there are reasons for why I do, what I do. What I do can ruffle feathers. And no, you were not left out on purpose, we didn't communicate as we should, you are still in.
After all, you were the only member who volunteered for my committee, you didn't ask to be on it, just offered assistance. All the others I had to hunt out. Don't think I forgot about that! Thanks!!!!
I will let you know when we meet again, hopefully after the next board meeting.
Well, I need shut eye, gotta be 150 miles from here at 8AM, and I've been turning big wrenches all day.
Have a great day!!!
Later, Andy[/quote:2w1kqvu0]